(07-24-2022, 03:16 PM)Canadian-bacon Wrote: The argument that gang roleplay is 'dying' is in bad faith. Nothing is dying because the rules surrounding mugging and robbery is the same as day 1. Gangs come and go as is the nature of street life, the only inference is from the players who feel as those that mass mug, mass rob do so because of an affinity / familiarity with DarkRP. As opposed to the roleplay aspects that come from dealing with organized crime to the disorganized gangs.

Fair points, i dont think anyone wants people who mass mug and to turn this into dark rp, I think what we are getting at is a change to punish mass mugging but  also protect just a simple one off mugging that can put a faction in danger. For example, when doing a drug deal in an alley, the thought of the police possible rolling around and spotting you is in the back of your mind, but some guys coming around the corner to rob you isnt. The reason being you have that assurance or a safety blanket that you will be monetarily compensated and or the guy that mugged you will be PK'ed. All you have to do is clip it and send it to your boss. There is no threat of being robbed bc the robber loses more in the end anyway. When realistically hes not going to be found unless me mugs a high command of a faction or someone else important. But the fact you can be chased down and burned at the stake for stealing a pistol and a cheeseburger off an associate is kind of crazy.

We're not cultivating a balanced Dark RP environment and the concept of 'fair' in the underworld doesn't exist. I don't feel the need to hold anyone's hand when they play the server but have you considered roleplaying it? Having talks and political roleplay with mobs and families to be allies and be their tools, their button men, robbing their rivals and attacking territories in conjunction with their funding, as is your speciality. Having the backing of a criminal network as opposed to trying to be an independent "fuck the wops" gang that attempts to 1v10 all the factions and then complains on the forums when they are squashed as the bugs they act like?

Personally tried doing things like this multiple times and the answer ive got is "we dont outsource our criminal jobs". Thats a two way street and if no one pays for me to go shoot up a building, kidnap some one, etc then there isnt a way i can do it without starting something with a faction unprovoked. So if i cant do the cool gang rp shit of working with people to do dirty work bc no one outsources, i cant mug without getting into a war, a gang is no different than any other faction that makes money and sits around at their properties.
 
Try new things. Evolve. If your gang is 'dying' the problem is your leadership, not the server rules.

I dont think anyone's gang is dying due to not being able to mug, however mugging for gangs should be treated differently than a civ on an alt that mass mugs. Mugging is a part of gang rp. Not all gangs mass mug.

(07-24-2022, 07:29 PM)sharuji Wrote: Now, one thing I will compromise on is that existing factions very minimally ever make compromises because they've consolidated their power so much that they don't have to. Faction RP is an echo chamber, and when they own all the buildings, rackets, guns, and no one can feasibly even question them; it gets insanely boring. I don't know if changing the mugging rules is the way to fix that, but I can agree that factions never outsource, and if you're not a previous faction member who can gain support already without serious effort, getting started up is next to impossible.

There's an argument meant to be made that becoming a true criminal faction isn't meant to be easy, but there's a lot of RP-stifling attitudes that factions engage in that very heavily limit possible activities.

So I'm gonna switch my vote to neutral because I get where you're coming from about most factions making it impossible to upstart any other way, but mugging rules changing and trying to 'stick it to them' through mugging isn't a real solution either. Only real solution I can think of is changing the war criteria to 'direct, proven financial slights'. For one, masks should make any attempt to recognize someone by their voice later invalid. Defeats the entire point of them.

(07-24-2022, 03:16 PM)Canadian-bacon Wrote: The argument that gang roleplay is 'dying' is in bad faith. Nothing is dying because the rules surrounding mugging and robbery is the same as day 1. Gangs come and go as is the nature of street life, the only inference is from the players who feel as those that mass mug, mass rob do so because of an affinity / familiarity with DarkRP. As opposed to the roleplay aspects that come from dealing with organized crime to the disorganized gangs.

We're not cultivating a balanced Dark RP environment and the concept of 'fair' in the underworld doesn't exist. I don't feel the need to hold anyone's hand when they play the server but have you considered roleplaying it? Having talks and political roleplay with mobs and families to be allies and be their tools, their button men, robbing their rivals and attacking territories in conjunction with their funding, as is your speciality. Having the backing of a criminal network as opposed to trying to be an independent "fuck the wops" gang that attempts to 1v10 all the factions and then complains on the forums when they are squashed as the bugs they act like?

Try new things. Evolve. If your gang is 'dying' the problem is your leadership, not the server rules.