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+---- Thread: PK Appeal Ron Myers (/showthread.php?tid=5999)
PK Appeal Ron Myers - sefin_the_savage - 06-11-2023
Name of Character: Ron Myers
SteamID: STEAM_0:1:452302000
Your Discord ID#: Sefin#7446
Date of PK: 6/10/2023
Reason for PK: Fail Mug
Why should you be unPK'd? What server rule or PK rule was violated?: My PK did not meet the PK criteria listed "fail mug". The player I attempted to mug broke the fear RP guidelines. The reason the admin stated was that if someone pulls a gun on you and kills you as you attempt to mug them, then you are PKed. Checking the server rules, we can find no evidence of this under both the mugging and Fear Rp guidelines. If this "rule" was not listed in the official rules then it should not be enforced.
If possible please provide video evidence or photo evidence if PK does not follow the guidelines:
https://medal.tv/games/garrys-mod/clips/1dzb6YNSXhy04i/d1337IxEFaBC?invite=cr-MSw3aGssMjM4NTUwMTQs
FearRP Rules
While under fearrp it's recommended you oblige by the commands of your captor, if you attempt to escape or pull out a weapon to fight back but are killed that would display a disregard for your own safety, a calculated risk you took which failed, resulting in your PK. (In some circumstances staff may use their discretion to issues a ban instead)
Acting in complete disregard for your life and being killed can be a PK at staff's discretion.
If you're holding someone under Fear RP and issue them orders/warnings not to do something and they disobey you may kill them. However, one single warning/order will not suffice, multiple warnings in a very short time span will also not suffice, you have to give them adequate time to react.
You must have a valid reason to place someone under fear RP (Valid Mugging, Valid Kidnapping or any Valid Kill reason); placing someone under Fear RP without reason or just in order to bait a PK is not permitted and may result in a ban or character removal (This can include any mugging or kill reasons. When doing this you are at risk of possible PK if killed)
If the person with the weapon puts it away or turns his line of sight (Meaning the user has turned completely away and is not even slightly facing you. Usually an angle of larger than 90 degrees), fearRP becomes null and you may take the window of opportunity to retaliate with little to no risk. (Does not apply if multiple weapons are pointed at you)
Continually putting yourself into fearrp scenarios in order to to PK people, or 'PK hunting' / being 'PK hungry' is not permitted (Mass Muging, baiting, shootouts on alt characters). If an Admin feels like you're doing things intentionally for no regard for actual roleplay they may deny your PK requests or issue according punishments.
For FearRP to apply with a knife the perpetrator must be within stabbing distance.
If you are holding a weapon actively in your hand then fearrp does not apply and you may retaliate (even if it is on safety, E+R)
If you are at a more than a reasonable distance you may escape without risk. (Generally measured as about a block away, or any other reasonable distance where you could duck into cover.)
Fearrp no longer applies when you shoot and damage the victim, they may retaliate without risk.
When attempting to FearRP a driver or passenger inside a vehicle you must be within 5 feet of the car, your weapon must be pointed at them as you issue commands for them to exit, and the car must be imobilized, either pitted, unable to move or in a parked position. FearRP does not apply to individuals in a fast moving car.
FearRP applies to cops differently than other players. Cops are routinely put through situations where they must draw their weapon, therefore they require double the amount of weapons pointed at them for fearRP to apply; FearRP is only applicable to cops if they are outnumbered with 2 or more weapons. It is reasonable for a law enforcement officer to attempt to reach for their weapon if there is only one individual. (1 cop requires 2 people, 2 cops requires 4 people, etc etc, doubling each time)
Mugging Rules
You may not mug in a public place, you can, however, pull a weapon on them and bring them to a secluded area to rob them (This can only be done when there is no one else around. EXAMPLE: The victim is alone at night in the middle of an empty street. You initiate a mugging with your firearm and take them to an alleyway so no one stumbles upon the crime. You may not perform the mugging in the street, which is a public area.)
Secluded and non public areas include; Alleys, dark corners, abandoned buildings and areas void of other players or NPCs.
You may NOT mug in front of NPCs as they are considered witnesses in RP. You may not bypass this rule by attempting to 'pull them away under fearrp' infront of an NPC. Do not target people using NPCs/ATMs.
In a similar vein you may not camp shipments to mug the owner, using the name on the box is meta knowledge.
You may only kill the victim if they DO NOT comply with your demands. Victims that comply are to be left unharmed.
-Likewise you may only make realistic demands, this means you can’t demand something unrealistic that the victim cannot deliver in order to kill them.
You may mug one person / singular group of people every 15 minutes. Mugging again immediately, before allowing the timer to expire will be considered Mass Mugging. Realistically you must lay low after mugging someone.
Mass mugging in order to to PK people, or 'PK hunting' / being 'PK hungry' is not permitted. If an Admin feels like you're doing things intentionally for no regard for actual roleplay they may deny your PK requests issue according punishments
You may not make a character for the sole purpose of mugging, for example if you are pk'ed for mugging and simply create a new character and continue the same actions. It shows you have no regard for actual roleplay.
You may not kill or attack people for stumbling onto your mugging or witnessing it. Mug in secluded locations to avoid being seen.
You may tie the victim and rob them of the items in their inventory.
You may NOT mug AFK users who are busy interacting with an NPC/ATM.
Once you have finished mugging a user who has complied completely with the mugging you must flee the scene and abandon them.
-This means you may NOT kill or cripple them unnecessarily. (Shooting them once is not crippling. But leaving them to bleed out is)
-And you may not take them as hostage/kidnapping without a proper RP reason; mugging is not a valid reason for kidnapping/ransom.
You may not mug the same person more than once within a span of 30 minutes.
You may scam people in a deal (Taking their item / Money and running away, stealing it). You are subject to the PK rules and mugging rules. You may not kill them to scam them.
If you disconnect within 15 minutes after you scam/mug, or disconnect in order to scam you can be PK'ed or banned by staff for LTARP.
Be cautious! If you are killed while committing a mugging you have the possibility of being PK 'ed.
RE: PK Appeal Ron Myers - BoomRoasted - 06-11-2023
Failmug, Fail FearRp are almost synonymous throughout the rules. Everyone has a ability to defend themselves if they so choose, one you never gave any commands you wiped out a gun and said " How does it feel to be mugged". Bringing her under Fearrp by pointing a gun at her, she choose to pull a gun out, now if you killed her she would have been PK'd why would we not have the same rules about you pointing a gun at someone and then dying during a mug? Read the last part of the rules you listed: " if you are killed while committing a mugging you have the possibility of being PK'ed.
RE: PK Appeal Ron Myers - sefin_the_savage - 06-11-2023
Validity of FearRP: The rules state that when a player points a weapon at someone and initiates a mugging, the person being mugged is expected to oblige by the commands of the captor under FearRP. By pointing the gun and stating, "How does it feel to be mugged," I successfully initiated the mugging and placed the other player under FearRP.
Reasonable Reaction: While the other player chose to pull out their own gun in response, it can be argued that this action violated FearRP. FearRP requires valuing one's life in a realistic manner. By pulling out a weapon and escalating the situation, the other player demonstrated a disregard for their own safety. This disregard should not absolve them of the consequences outlined in the FearRP rules.
Roleplay Immersion: Mugging scenarios are intended to create immersive roleplay experiences. By adhering to the established rules, I aimed to contribute to the overall enjoyment and engagement of the game for all parties involved. Punishing the mugger with a PK for a situation that followed the intended gameplay mechanics may discourage players from engaging in dynamic and immersive roleplay scenarios in the future.
Roleplay Consequences: The outcome of a mugging scenario should be driven by in-game consequences and roleplay, rather than resorting immediately to PK. If the mugging encounter resulted in the death of either party, it could lead to further roleplay opportunities, such as revenge plots or character development, which enriches the overall gameplay experience for everyone involved.
Consistency in Enforcement: It is crucial to ensure consistency in enforcing the rules. If similar situations have occurred in the past, where Fear RP applied to the person being mugged, its reasonable to expect the same treatment in this case. The rules should be applied equally to all players to maintain fairness and uphold the integrity of the gameplay experience. Ive known this server and game mode for awhile, and I never heard of this happen before.
Distinction between Failmug and Fail FearRP: While Failmug and Fail FearRP may be related, they are not synonymous. Failmug refers to a failed attempt at mugging or improperly following the mugging rules, while Fail FearRP refers to a violation of the realistic valuation of one's life.
RE: PK Appeal Ron Myers - BoomRoasted - 06-11-2023
Again read the last part of the mugging rule. She did not violate FearRp, the first rule states : While under fearrp it's recommended you oblige by the commands of your captor, if you attempt to escape or pull out a weapon to fight back but are killed that would display a disregard for your own safety, a calculated risk you took which failed, resulting in your PK.
She choose to not take the recommended steps and fight back, she did not die you did.
Your Roleplay consequences argument is sort of illogical as in this situation, you DIED. THAT IS YOUR CONSEQUENCE. There is something called NLR, when you died in this exchange, even if she didn't want to PK you, you would be break server rules by " further roleplay" or "character development". She put the PK request in, and I granted it, as the rules clearly dictates that if you mug someone and die you have the possibility of being PK'd.
RE: PK Appeal Ron Myers - Irebelle - 06-15-2023
"Be cautious! If you are killed while committing a mugging you have the possibility of being PK 'ed."
-Rule 15 under mugging rules
https://divergenet.works/forums/showthread.php?tid=340
Your appeal has been reviewed and denied.
We have determined this PK to be reasonable and/or justified.
You may not re-appeal this PK.